View Full Version : DEATH and the REALITY of it
07-23-2013, 11:37 AM
Hello my WHL FAMILY. I wanted to tell you about a tragedy my family and I faced just this past December 6th, 2012. I wasnt ready to "face it" I guess you could say (still dont some days) so I chose only a couple of my very close friends here on WHL to tell. I had a few reasons why I didnt "share" with the "whole family", one being facing the REALITY of how and why it happened. So many other reasons as well that are personal, extremely emotional and OVERWHELMING for me to deal with on a daily basis. BUT, I have been thinking it over since the tragedy and I feel like if I can even touch just 1 person, then its worth sharing.
My WONDERFUL and BEAUTIFUL Papa (my DAD) died (ugh, the words are HARD to write and I dont say them much either because of the pain) in December. We found him in his home (the HOME my family and I visited on a weekly basis) on December 8th in his hallway dead from a seizure brought on by alcohol poisoning. It was the most HORRIFIC moment of my life. He was an alcoholic and had been my whole life. Yet, he was my BEST FRIEND, MY PAPA, MY DADDY, MY FATHER and he had the BIGGEST HEART over anyone I have ever known.
I had to give him an ultimatum when my children were young because his alcohlism was poison in our lives. He didnt even hesitate, he agreed and our relationship FLUORISHED from that point on in a way I could never have imagined. 90% of the time he didnt get drunk when we were with him. If he did, we would leave and he would understand and not be upset.
I had talked to him just 2 hrs before he died. We were supposed to visit him on that Sunday, he died on Thursday. We found him on Saturday.
I talked to him almost every day. And I MISS HIM EVERY SECOND of EVERY MINUTE of EVERY DAY. I had a "SOBER PAPA" in my life and I LOVED IT BUT, I didnt think about what he was STILL doing when we werent on the phone or together. My illnesses clouded my mind or maybe I was just in denial, Im not really sure. I honestly thought he was not as bad as he was. I saw him sober MOST of our time together. THAT was "MY PAPA" to ME. Since then neighbors have told me things and family have told me things about how BAD his drinking was and always had been.........
He had gotten worse when I started getting sicker I have been told. He was proud of me "fighting" my "fight" BUT he hated seeing my life having changed so much. It tears me apart knowing this. He always told me "baby, I couldnt do what you do every day, youre a fighter and you have such a good attitude about it all...." I didnt think he would EVER CHOOSE to leave my family and I (me especially). WE WERE SO CLOSE and he knew I NEEDED HIM on so many ways........ I found out after his death that he was telling people he was going to drink himself to death. HE CHOSE. THIS HURTS, BAD......... He had even left his will sitting out on his desk for me to easily find.
I want anyone who KNOWS an alcoholic or IS an alcoholic to HEAR ME and to UNDERSTAND the PAIN I am in every day because of my papa choosing to die by being an alcoholic. YOU HURT the ones that LOVE YOU the most....... I will NEVER forget that day. The way vomit was dripping from his mouth that he had choked on, the way one of his slippers was off his foot, the positioning of his hands (seizure), the "look" on his face, the clothes he was wearing, the beer cans and empty bottles of rum lined up in a row on his counter, what was on his TV, the weather.............. AND MOST OF ALL the PAIN that still has not and will not ever go away from losing my BEST FRIEND, MY PAPA............
I deal with SO MANY "what ifs". People tell you not to, BUT, its not possible, we are human. I am dealing with the fact (along with so many other facts) that I WAS NOT IMPORTANT ENOUGH for him to get help. Im NOT looking for pitty, I am just wanting to share my story HOPEING I might make a difference for anyone on either side of this HORRIBLE DISEASE to HEAR ME. PLEASE make a change so loved ones dont have to go through what I am going through EVERY SECOND of EVERY MINUTE of EVERY HOUR of EVERY DAY.........
I LOVE YOU MY DEAR PAPA and I MISS YOU SO DAMN MUCH..............
07-23-2013, 02:50 PM
07-23-2013, 03:52 PM
as a mother of a alcoholic I deal with this fear everyday thankyou very much for sharing your story and I am so sorry about your father. love kim
07-23-2013, 05:43 PM
Im so sorry for your loss. Please remember to try and take special care of yourself while you are greiving. Its a hard time to get through. Sending you prayers.
07-23-2013, 05:49 PM
I am so very sorry, that you have to go through this pain.
Even though, I don't know anything about alcoholics, my understanding is, that they don't think, that they have a problem. I would think, that might be the reason, your dad didn't seek help and not because you are not important enough to him.
We are here for you, always.
07-23-2013, 07:39 PM
I'm so very sorry that you had to go through this.
My brother-in-law died of alcohol poisoning at age 25. Alcoholism is an insidious disease and impacts everyone in the family.
I, too, had to issue an ultimatum to a family member about their drinking. Fortunately, it worked, and he never drank in the presence of me or my children (he lived out of state so I don't know if he continued drinking when not around us, but he sounded sober on the phone). I was prepared, however, to never see him again if he didn't honor my wishes, though.
Anyway, know that I understand your grief and the heartache from your loss. Your beloved dad chose that darn bottle, not because he didn't love you, but because he didn't love himself.
07-24-2013, 02:19 AM
All I can think of to say is we are here for you
Death is hard. Waiting for it to come is even harder. My Mom is begging for drinks cause she can't face the reality that my Dad can go at any moment from a heart attack. How can we expect to live a normal life?
Alcohol is wrong, but she is so gpitiful that my dad gives in. How can they cope with reality.
I'm with you on this
07-24-2013, 02:47 AM
you are a dear friend...... and we have shared our stories with each other. all I can really say is I am here for you. we are a cyber family. and because we are world wide, someone is awake when you need to talk. it is by sharing our stories that we as a family really come together.
07-24-2013, 10:31 AM
You are so brave for telling us this story. I am sorry to hear that your Father "chose" to die in such a way. You are right, the alcoholic not only hurts him/her self, but also everyone who cares about them.
My mother is an alcoholic and is now abusing her prescriptive medication. She refuses to acknowledge her drinking problem and/or her drug abuse problem. Instead, she has chosen to kick me out of her life because I confronted her with the way that her drinking and drug use affects me. She continues to say that she does not have a drinking problem and that her issues are not because of her abuse of her medications. Instead, I am her problem because I keep telling people she's a "Drunk" (a word I have Never used). She continues to do this even after being hospitalized twice for her alcoholism and abuse of medications, after being told by her psychiatrist, her therapist, and her physician that she is an alcoholic and abuses her prescriptive medications. Unfortunately, I can do nothing to help my mother as she (unlike your father) does not respect me enough to not drink when she is around me. I fear the day when I will find my mother like you found your father.
You are so blessed to know that your father respected and loved you enough to remain sober in your presence. I know that it is difficult to hang on to those blessings when you know that he chose to end his life in such a way that you had to find him! I am so sorry that this image remains in your head and will probably do so for quite a long time. I wish that there was something that I could do or say to bring you comfort. But I know that comfort will come in its own time and in a way that is best for you. Just know that you are loved here and that we will always be here to provide you with anything that you need.
Thank you so much for having the bravery to share your story with us. I can't imagine how difficult it must have been and for that, I am sending you my love, my thoughts, and my prayers.
Peace and Blessings
07-24-2013, 11:11 AM
Oh Steve, you are so comforting to me and THANK YOU for being here from the beginning. Even though it took me SO LONG to face the TRUTH of his death and tell someone. Even then I could only tell a select few out of embarrasment. I know I shouldnt be embarrased BUT I lived my whole life as a child and into adulthood to "keep quiet" and "dont tell anyone"...........I STILL feel "that". I also (as you know from our talks) have always been the one everyone comes to and I HELP THEM, Im the "pick me up person" and thats what Ive known and who I AM. BUT, Im not going to lie, IM ON OVERLOAD. Ive been so drained........... I DO have this STRONG FEELING that I have never had before to WANT, NEED, YURN and LONG for HELP............... THANK YOU to EVERYONE here. I am so happy I finally shared. I am just not used to leaning on others BUT I DO NEED YOU in a BIG WAY.............. XXXOOO
07-24-2013, 11:27 AM
Ruziska, I FELT YOUR HUG it was so BIG, THANK YOU. Kim, SO SORRY for the FEAR you live EVERY DAY, my HEART goes out to YOU. Shelly, THANK YOU for the prayers, SO SWEET. Debbie, THANK YOU for "being here" for ME, its so COMFORTING to here. I FEEL ALONE at times. BonusMom, Im so sorry you can relate to my pain. UGH You made me cry HARD just now when I read "he didnt love himself". YOU are RIGHT. I hadnt thought about "that". I think (KNOW) I havent wanted to "face it". It TEARS me apart knowing it. OMG! the frigin PAIN!!!!!!!! It hits SO HARD and I LONG for my Papa!!!!!! He was so depressed and family and friends have been telling me how much worse he was because he was worrying about me all the time. UGH PAPA! I think, "if he was so worried, WHY would he make me go through this DAMN IT!!!!" He DID chose, he TOLD people..... HOW CAN I BE "OK" with "that"? Oh Nonna, I WISH you couldnt relate either. SO SORRY...... YOU are in myHEART. THANK YOU for the BIG HUG......
07-24-2013, 11:58 AM
Oh Carlotta, I cant THANK YOU enough for the words you have chosen and what you have said to me. YOU are DEAR to ME and I have always told you this BUT now, through this PAIN, I mean it MORE than EVER..... I WAS EMBARRESED to "share". I cant lie, I was afraid of "rejection" as well. I have gone my WHOLE LIFE covering things up, not telling anyone "things", putting on the "happy face" for those around me while Im feeling "DEAD" inside....... you keep your "secrets" for fear of not being "liked" or "accepted" by those you CARE ABOUT and LOVE/LIKE....... My own mother too is an alcoholic, as well as my sister. I LITTERALLY am the ONLY SOBER person in my family (outside of Carl and the kids). Ive had SO MANY "issues/problems" with Karens (mom) and Dawns (sister) alcoholism that they are no longer in my life either. Havent been for yrs. They chose and it HURTS. But Im at peace with "that" (Dawn and Karen). I was so CLOSE to Papa it made up for Dawn and Karen being a "mess" and not being in my life. I even TRIED getting Karen HELP for her problems BUT i soon realized through so much pain that I CANT CHANGE HER. I forgive her and Dawn, thats how I have moved on. They are ill and I am sad for them..... BUT, I have this feeling I am trying to "deal with" of "abandonment", especially NOW. Papa chose to "leave me" now too. Him and I had a relationship I thought I could never have considering my childhood. He and Karen physically and emotionally abused my sister and I growing up. Alcohol and abuse.......BUT, my papa cried and cried and asked for my forgiveness when I was pregnant at 17. I forgave him and we moved on AND I LOVE HIM SO MUCH FOR THAT. He FELT REMORSE for what he did and I felt "that" from him. It was easy to forgive. We grew EXTREMELY CLOSE after that. He gave Ashleigh (my daughter) what he couldnt and didnt give me as a baby/child. I could tell it made him feel good and THAT made me SO HAPPY for him.....
I AM SO SORRY about your mother Carlotta. UGH huh? WE CAN DO NOTHING, it has to come from THEM and you feel so helpless dont you..... Its sad shes in denial, so sorry... I CANT SAY IT ENOUGH. Unfortunatley, my papa DID KNOW he was sick. He said it all the time. "I know Im an alcoholic, I want to be" he would say. UGH IT HURTS either way doesnt it.......... I hope one day your mother WILL change her vicious cycle she is in. Not just for herself BUT for those who love her..... YOU ARE IN MY HEART in so MANY WAYS Carlotta. THANK YOU and LOVE YOU XXXOOO
07-25-2013, 10:19 AM
You are so right, there is nothing that we can do to help those who are in the clutches of alcohol and drugs. My family is much like yours, there are more members who are addicted than there are not. My brother and I feel like we are the only sober people in our family. My mother gave my son his first drink of alcohol when he was 8yrs old (I don't think I have ever forgiven her for that). She got him "DRUNK" on beer at the age of 8!! Can you imagine a grandmother doing that to her grandchild??? She thought it was funny!! She was babysitting and when my husband and I arrived to pick my son up..he was throwing up drunk. We were mortified and enraged and my mother couldn't understand our anger because she thought it was funny!! By the way, she was drunk too! I never allowed my kids to spend the night with her again.
Subsequently, my son ended up with an alcohol problem (he has been sober for 11yrs now). So, I do have a lot of resentment against my mother and her alcohol use. I am not even sure if I still love my mother and I know that this is a horrible thing to say.
I was once embarrassed to talk about my mother's addiction and/or my son's. However, I have been through years and years of therapy and have learned that; Everyone has a story and we all are living with some type of dysfunction. So, we are never alone, rarely judged, and always accepted and embraced by someone who understands and cares.
You are a part of our family here and you are especially dear to me. We have been friends for quite a while and I have always held you in my heart. You have a loving spirit that I have always found comfort in and admired. So, THANK YOU for being who you are and for always caring about me! Warm hugs coming your way filled with kisses!
Peace and Blessings
07-25-2013, 11:39 AM
OMG Carlotta! I CRIED when I read your post! I LOVE YOU SO MUCH! THANK YOU for being who YOU ARE as well. I battle my self esteem because of growing up how I did. Marijo (Oluwa) has been WONDERFUL through this all. Her losing Bola and our friendship made me reach out to her, shes AMAZING...... Anyways, she keeps telling me to BELIEVE in myself and who I am.... Shes right.... Its still a struggle alot of the time though.....To HEAR you say what I am to YOU and who I am to YOU WARMS ME TO THE CORE...... I KNOW that I struggle with BELIEVING in myself because of that feeling of ABANDONMENT by BOTH parents (dad never made me feel that way since we grew closer over the yrs BUT I FEEL that way now from him since his death). Even my sister and I have NEVER beeen close.....WE are 2 VERY DIFFERENT people in our personalities and she is an alcoholic.....THAT I cant have a relationship with..... I am and always have been SOBER......I feel like "what have I done wrong?" or "am I not important enough?" , "why am I not important enough?" ..........Karen(mother) told me yrs ago during one of our MANY disagreements, "Jeannette, I only have 1 daughter, I took you out of the will"........ OK, see ya BYE....... I honestly am "OK" and at PEACE about her and Dawn BUT it doesnt take away that feeling of "not being ENOUGH"....... I let myself have a "pitty party" when I NEED to BUT then I MOVE ON because it does me no good. THEY WILL NEVER CHANGE....
OMG, your son at 8!!!???? WOW! SO SORRY! I totally RELATE. I cant tell you how many times Karen laughed at the most AWFUL things she SAID or DID to my family or I.... Crazy and irrational, RIGHT?...... MESSED UP is more like it. BUT then if you remember WHO you are dealing with, it makes "sense". Your mother sounds so much like Karen and the things she has done over the yrs before I FINALLY cut her out of our lives for good. (It was on and off for so long because I YEARNED for her to be the mom I finally realized she will never be and has never been). My therapist helped me with the whole thing. I saw the REALITY of it all and I CONTROLLED what I was able to and let the rest go....... I had to, for my family AND myself.....
Sorry for your pain through the yrs (and still) with alcoholics Carlotta. I HURT for YOU..... I UNDERSTAND YOU........ WOO FRIGIN HOO to your sons 11yr sobriety though!!!!! YIPPEEEEEEEEEEE......................THAT makes me EXTREMELY HAPPY for you,him, your husband and anyone else who is in your lives it affected.....
No, its NOT horrible to say you think you dont love your mother anymore. I GET IT. I FEEL THE SAME WAY. I stopped calling her mom a while ago. Like Carl said "she hasnt BEEN a mom to you, EVER, so how can you FEEL "it"....... SO much pain from her and Dawn.....My love went away LONG AGO. I dont feel any "shame" or "discomfort" saying it. Not when I KNOW what they have done to ME, CARL and MY CHILDREN. DONT MESS WITH MY KIDS...... YOU know THAT feeling. Do what you will to me BUT dont F~~K with my kids.......That has ALWAYS been a line if ever crossed by ANYONE (family or not) then we have some talking to do with one another......
I guess I have a hard time with feeling like Im "ok" or "worthy" (however you want to look at it) too is because only about 1 1/2 yrs ago my dad called me drunk ( he usually wouldnt because he KNEW I couldnt talk to him like "THAT") and he told me something I NEVER KNEW. He said him and Karen felt such "guilt" and "sadness" that they agreed to never tell me (Dawn doesnt even know). BUT, he was wondering if my Drs could "use" the information to "help" me. UGH.... He said I almost died when I was born because Karen drank and didnt take care of herself during her pregnancy with me. I was in the hospital for weeks and they didnt think I was going to make it. He was crying so hard. I forgave him for not telling me. Not Karen though. THAT one Im having a HARDER time forgiving her for. I feel like "gosh, she didnt care ENOUGH about ME from the start, LITERALLY". Now I know why I have ADHD! LOL Didnt figure THAT out until a few yrs ago though! Adderall helped me FINISH a book for the first time in my life!! LOL GOTTA LAUGH, RIGHT!!!!!!
07-25-2013, 11:43 AM
OMG! I should have just frigin PM you! LOL SO SORRY! I HONESTLY didnt know I HAD ALL THAT IN ME to purge to you! LOL Its AMAZING to relate to someone! ESPECIALLY it being YOU!!!!! It makes "this" that much easier. I will release you of my purging now! LOL I ADORE and LOVE YOU!!!!!
HIGS and KISSES right back at ya!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
07-25-2013, 07:02 PM
this thread may be helpful ....... http://forum.wehavelupus.com/showthread.php?13048-are-you-enough
07-26-2013, 06:34 PM
Our vulnerability, our fears..speak of them. Stand in your truth and fear not to be judge...it sets your heart and mind free. As you can see you are loved in your vulnerability and all, Jeannette. I am glad you decided to share it with your friends here..WHL family. They will always uplift you, support you, love you through all of your life's adversities and just not your illnesses. We have more in common than just our illnesses. Hugs with love...Oluwa.
07-29-2013, 10:09 AM
Thanks for sharing your story. So sorry it was so sad.
07-29-2013, 01:07 PM
I had to chuckle at your last post! How sweet and funny you are (lol). No worries about the purge, that is exactly why we are here and especially why I am here. We are, actually, purging with one another. I have never discussed what my mother did to my son or my ambivalence about loving her to anyone other than my therapist and my husband. For some reason, I knew that you would understand exactly what I meant and how I felt!
I have lived with years and years of her saying horrible things and not taking responsibility for her words; and with her doing horrible things and not taking responsibility for her actions. Like you (how funny), I, too, have been written out of my mother's will. Now, I am not bragging, but the truth is (and I told her) that I am very well taken care of, I have all that I need and more, I live a wonderfully full and exciting life, I am in a beautiful home, I have an adoring and devoted husband, and I want for nothing...what the hell do I need to be in her will for??? She has absolutely NOTHING that I want or need! So, when she told me that she had taken me out of her will, I simply laughed and told her the above.
I, with the help of years and years of therapy (and with the love and encouragement of my sweet Lauri), finally know that I am valuable and I am beautiful and I am worthy. If my mother cannot see this, then it is her loss because I have so much love to give. But, I will not be trampled on, disrespected, taken for granted, or made to feel guilty! The same goes for you...Please know and always remember that you are so very valuable to so many of us and, as I mentioned before, you have an adoring nature that I love and respect! You are more than you think you are!! Warm hugs and loving kisses
Peace and Blessings
07-30-2013, 08:20 AM
I used to have a key ring ............... no one can make me feel inferior, without my consent. I think both of you two ladies know this is true.
08-04-2013, 10:31 AM
Steve YOU sound like my therapist! LOL He has said the SAME THING to me time and again! I KNOW only WE can give someone the "power"........ Im pretty good at UNDERTSANDING "that", I just have a harder time DOING it on a regular basis! LOL Im much better than I used to be believe it or not! Its a thought process I have to make myself go through in certain "moments" to KNOW IM A GOOD PERSON.......SHOOT, I never even used to be able to SAY THAT just a few yrs ago let alone BELIEVE IT...... I DO BELIEVE!!!!!! WOO HOO!!!!!!! LOL
THANK YOU for the "link"..............You are KIND and THOUGHTFUL in SO MANY WAYS Steve.......We are LUCKY HERE to HAVE YOU.......
Oh my SWEET SWEET "Oluwa"!!!!! Your WISE WORDS once again!!!!!! Another BEAUTIFUL SOUL we here are BLESSED to have in our lives on WHL!!!! You have been AMAZING through my pain and even before.........THANK YOU.............SISTER FRIEND!
08-04-2013, 10:35 AM
Oh Jaynie! THANK YOU for the HUG I COULD FEEL! Seriously, it was so BIG!!! I meditate *well, at least TRY (LOL) at times*, so i literally closed my eyes and "saw" the hug you "typed" and I could "FEEL IT".................... SO KIND......................
08-04-2013, 10:58 AM
Once again Carlotta, YOU have WARMED ME to the CORE..... We are only human......Its NICE to be told I am LOVED, VALUED, IMPORTANT etc.....by those I LOVE, VALUE and are IMPORTANT to ME...... YOU are BEAUTIFUL in MANY WAYS as I have told you before and will KEEP telling YOU because I FEEL like, WHY NOT SHARE OUR GOOD THOUGHTS to one another when we have/feel them, RIGHT? Ive ALWAYS told my children "that".Theres too much cruelty and mean natured people in the world to NOT tell those we care about HOW WE FEEL........For MANY reasons BUT one of them being, YOU NEVER KNOW IF YOU WILL HAVE THAT CHANCE AGAIN.....I have NO REGRETS about NOT telling my papa how much I LOVED HIM. THAT is the one thing I have always done in my life. I told papa I LOVED HIM, I VALUED HIM,I APPRECIATED HIM IN MANY WAYS etc. ALL THE TIME and I AM SO GREATFUL for THAT. HE KNEW HOW I FELT ABOUT HIM and WHY I FELT that way about him. He would cry sometimes when I told him. He would feel so good and important, BECAUSE HE WAS...... UGH I MISS HIM SO MUCH! My family and I would ALWAYS leave special NOTES around his house for him to find and HE LOVED IT! The SIMPLE THINGS mean the MOST......The police officers and coroners "that day" told us how much he must have been loved by us because of all the little notes they saw everywhere......Papa would stick them in every room all over things for him to see when he was in that room. He said it made him smile. Oh my papa....................
WOW, I cant believe your mother said the same thing about HER will as well Carlotta! OMG! I felt the EXACT same way as YOU when Karen said THAT. I HONESTLY DID NOT CARE. It HONESTLY DID NOT bother me in ANY WAY. THATS what her and I had come to. As a matter of FACT, my life was much LESS STRESSFUL when I would cut her out of it. I gave her way too many chances as it was my therapist had told me. BUT, it goes back to WANTING her to BE what a mother SHOULD BE. I had my fingers crossed my whole life BUT it never happened and it will never happen. My therapist told me I needed to grieve for the loss of my "mother" like she was dead. He was right.....Forgive, grieve and MOVE ON with MY LIFE because THATS whats IMPORTANT. If I feel sad about "it" sometimes, its NOT about NOT having Karen in my life, its about NOT having the MOM I DESERVE and NEVER had in my life. MOMS are IMPORTANT in MANY WAYS. WE KNOW THIS. So, you cant help but "LONG FOR" that sometimes at least.
LOVE and HUGS right back at ya!!!!!! XXXOOO
08-28-2013, 01:30 PM
I know Iím relatively new here and may not be my place to comment. Jeannette that is a horrible thing to have to go through and my heart breaks for you. Although hard to accept, Alcoholism is a disease. We often donít understand why they just wonít quit but because it is usually an Ďuntreatedí disease they think theyíre fine. On one hand it seems if they cared about us then they could control themselves and stop but on the other hand if itís a disease then itís can be justified that they had no control of it. Clearly your Dad loved you because he kept it together around you and your family. Regardless of how much we love someone itís impossible to be inside their head to know what they are thinking or feeling when we are not around them. And whatever thoughts were in your dads head at the time, he loved you enough to not want to burden you with it. I know you would never think of your Dad as a burden but maybe your dad did and as a parent he couldnít do that to the daughter he loved.
08-28-2013, 02:34 PM
Oh my word Craig..YOU MADE ME CRY....THANK YOU for YOUR WORDS of KINDNESS and WISDOM....I became a "daddys girl" when he chose US over his alcohol( MOST of the time anyways) and to have it taken away IS SO HARD for SO MANY REASONS that I BATTLE EVERY DAY. You are right in what you say,it is just HARD to accept I think.UGH! and to let you know, IT IS YOUR PLACE to comment because YOU ARE MY FRIEND and because ALL of US here on WHL are a family NO MATTER how long or short a time you have been with us.....I have gone MIA from here for a yr or more sometimes it feels and I come back like I was just on yesterday....I FEEL SO LOVED and CARED ABOUT here no matter how often I can be around......I have LEARNED from it that THAT is what a true FAMILY is.....NO STRINGS ATTACHED......THAT is FAMILY and FRIENDSHIP.....THANK YOU again Craig...YOU help ME too..